30. Pivoting to New Products with Lisa Markle

Stephanie 0:00

Welcome back to the podcast. I am so excited for today's episode because it is the long awaited first guest episode of Pay Less for Traffic. When I launched this podcast, I felt very strongly that we needed to have guests to come and talk about their own journey with organic marketing, because there are so many voices out there saying that you need to pay to play. You know, put a few dollars into an ad campaign over here, promote a pin over here, and you can really feel like you're starting to miss out on traffic opportunities when you don't pay for traffic. And so the guests on the podcast are going to be teacher business owners, just like you, who are seeing results for their business by using free traffic sources. And our first guest is doing just that.

Stephanie 0:51

Lisa from Lisa Markle Sparkles is a former preschool teacher turned digital illustrator. She got her start making preschool activities and clip art on Teachers Pay Teachers in 2015. She eventually added printable coloring pages to the mix, and she just published her second coloring book on Amazon. If you were to ask Lisa, she would probably tell you that she thinks she has made all the mistakes one could make in the blogging world, but really, her organic marketing efforts have helped to push her business in the right direction, and I'm really excited for you to hear her story, because I think there are a lot of things that you'll be able to relate to.

Stephanie 1:33

Hey there, teacher business owner, it's time to give your bank account a break and pause that ad campaign. I'm your host, Stephanie Royer, and I'm going to show you how to pay less for traffic.

Stephanie 1:45

Well, welcome to the podcast, Lisa. I am so excited that you decided to join us. I think your blogging story is something that a lot of people can relate to.

Lisa 1:55

Thank you. I'm excited.

Stephanie 1:57

Yeah, so why don't we just start if you want to tell us a little bit about yourself and your teaching background and TPT background, and we're gonna dive into like, what you're doing these days, but if you wanna just give a quick little introduction of what keeps you busy these days, that would be great.

Lisa 2:14

Hi. I'm Lisa. I was a preschool teacher for about seven years. I was an online ESL teacher for about three years after that, and then in the mix of that, I started making activities and clip art for teachers on teachers by teachers, which eventually led to coloring pages, printable and, you know, things for kids and moms and teachers, and eventually, just past year, that all led to me publishing my first two coloring books. So that's where I'm at now. And with the help of Stephanie, I have learned to, you know, bring my own traffic to said coloring books and products of all sorts.

Stephanie 3:06

I have to say, our family, we are very happy Lisa Markle Sparkles customers. We love your coloring books at our house.

Lisa 3:13

So, oh, I love it. That's so cool.

Stephanie 3:15

Yeah. And so you mentioned that you have a blog. Can you just tell us a little bit more about just the role that blogging has played in your business over the years?

Lisa 3:27

Well, I have to admit, blogging has never been one of my favorite things. I've made every mistake you could probably, you know, you've seen them all, and they're still there if you ever want to go look at them, because I haven't taken anything down. Everything's still there. So you can see the evolution of my blog. I would say I started my blog back when I was a VIP kid teacher, or online ESL teacher. I wanted to share how I used my own products in my little online classroom, and blogging was, you know, from what I heard, the way to do that. And it was also more comfortable for me because it wasn't on a camera. So I rather would like write about what I do instead of, you know, get on a camera and do everything like this. So I started there, and it just, I feel like I just would kind of throw spaghetti at the wall over the years, like I kind of just kept trying things to see what would work, if anything would, you know, take off. And, you know, I had Pinterest going with it. And I'll admit, it didn't feel like it was, like, really great going at the beginning. However, I did have people say that it made them feel like I was more official to, you know, have this website that they could just go to. It wasn't, you know, like a bitly link or something. So I feel like just having the website. It doesn't have to look, you know, like perfection. Just having like your official website makes you look just like you know what you're doing, which is hilarious, because I don't feel like I know what I'm doing.

Lisa 5:12

But eventually I started using my blog to give out free coloring pages, which, you know, I have a ton on there, and that seemed to start to get the traffic moving. And that's when I realized, like that was where my bread and butter was, and I started to kind of learn that that's what people wanted from me, and that's what was working for me. So I honed in on that, and that's why I started doing more coloring pages and promoting them more, and I learned how to do SEO and keywords and how to use the right keywords to get people to those coloring pages, and that seemed to work too. Like this past back to school season, I kind of took a step back from TPT and my website and everything because I was so busy getting these coloring books done. I didn't touch any of it. And I'm like, getting emails every day that I'm getting sales on these coloring pages from my website, and I'm not touching it. And it was floored, because, you know, here, I'm always thinking like, I have to work, work, work, work. And when you learn how to do these things right, and you put them together, it does it for you, and it kind of just keeps going. So that's how it's helped me. And I feel like it's a good example of you can make all the mistakes you can, you know, build the plane as you're flying it, and it still helps. You don't have to be perfect.

Stephanie 6:41

Yes, I love so much of what you said. I think one of the first things you talked about was when you started your blog, it came from a place of helping others, and that kind of content is what naturally does better on Google and on Pinterest. When you're writing content to help and inform that will naturally get people more interested in your products because they're seeing it in use, and it becomes more relevant for them, you know. And that's just such a great example of how to use your blog to feature your TPT products. But then, like you said, over time, you're starting to realize, well, wait, my audience is telling me something, and I think that is such an important thing for people to hear from you, is that once you have the traffic, then you can start learning from the traffic too, and it might not be what you expect like for you. You had all of this clip art that you were wanting to sell and all of these things, and you are selling it.

Lisa 7:47

It does, yeah.

Stephanie 7:48

It does sell. But then you're like, Well, wait, coloring pages. This is interesting. And so how exactly did you kind of evolve your strategy when you started to notice those changes, or just notice that little bit of traffic and interest in the coloring pages. How did you decide to start evolving and pivoting?

Lisa 8:09

I was doing the clip art and TPT and like printable coloring pages just as a whole, and it, I know a lot of other sellers felt this. Since 2020, and 2021, sales have not been predictable like they were. Some people say like they're making half of what they made. Some people are saying, like it's just kind of dwindling as they go. Mine were like slowly tipping off each year, and I was getting a little worried. So I was like, I have to do something. I have to figure out either how to add to this or how to improve it - something. I was just thinking about all kinds of different ideas. I was thinking about maybe completely pivoting and doing something totally different. I had all the ideas. And the whole time I'm looking at my blog and like I said, like, I just kept seeing like, people like these coloring pages, and I'm like, I already have this audience. Like, I don't want to take the risk of building a whole new audience from scratch, not knowing if it's going to work. So that's when I saw that the coloring pages were, you know, doing really well without me having to touch them. And you and I were always chatting about, like, SEO and like, you gave me all kinds of advice about Pinterest and keywords and and then you came out with your course, and you talked about, I love your analogies are the best. Your analogy about the tree as your website and your niche, and I kept thinking, if I use what I have and kind of try to branch from it and add to it, instead of just like, you know, throwing it away, starting again over here, that could work. And I feel like that would be quicker. And easier than throwing it away and, like, starting over here. So I took what you said in your course about how you talk about the tree trunk, and then you have your branches, and I don't want to go, like, too far into it and, like, hand it off, but I kept thinking, like, I'm giving away these free coloring pages. I have printable coloring pages, and for years, like one of my big things was to publish a coloring book, but I just kept, you know, pushing it away, because it felt like a big thing, and the thought of, like, putting a whole book together, just like it felt like a huge undertaking. So I kept thinking about it, and I was like, this feels like the next step. It flows. And I was like, You know what? I'm gonna put out one. I'm just gonna see what happens. I'm gonna put out one. I'm gonna use my, you know, my email list that I built, and my website and everything, and I'm just gonna do it. And I did, and I loved all the support I got, by the way, like, through the whole thing, like, everybody I knew kept asking, like, how far are you? Is it coming? Like, how's it going? And I am the type that, like, behind the scenes, I will always confide in people and say, like, Oh, I just don't know how this is going to go. I don't know, you know if they're going to like it, blah, blah. Like, I'm always worried. And I'll throw my friend Caitlyn in here. She was like, Lisa, look at all these people that love you. They're gonna, like, love this book. Like, how could they not? And when I announced that it was done and it was out, like, I had this outpouring of love and like, everybody grabbed one, and I was like, Oh my God. Like, I was so surprised. And it was amazing. And it just you had that instant feeling of like, yeah, this was right. This is what I should have done. But it was because I kept trying things with the website, and I kept adding to it, and I just kept, like, watching to see, like, what was popular and what was working. And I'm not the type to, like, really promote things a whole lot, like on Instagram, I don't I hate promoting. I hate marketing. That's something that doesn't come like, naturally to me. So seeing the natural, the traffic that just came from, like, learning SEO and everything - that really showed me what I needed to lean in on. Because that's the stuff that people just naturally came to and I'm not like, shoving it in your face, like, hey, come get this, because that I don't want to do that.

Stephanie: 12:29

Yeah, and I do think one of the reasons I love blogging and pinning so much is it's like the introvert's dream. You can just make your content and publish it and just let it do its thing, and people just naturally find you. But you know, you also had your social media. I mean, it was just a testament to building that audience and showing up for your audience consistently, like you have over the years, that really served you well with that launch. And so I am curious you mentioned the course, and thank you for being such a model student. Can you just give a few, just a few ideas of how taking that course changed just the way that you use your website.

Lisa: 13:15

It completely changed it. It really did. When you start a business, I guess it probably goes across the board, but like with TPT, I see this a lot with other people too. You get thrown a lot of, well, first, you know, you're just having fun making products, and it's great, and you're just creating, and you're like, Oh, this is awesome, I have a business, and I'm making stuff. And you're like, this, you know, you're having so much fun. And then you get bombarded with, you need an email list, you need a website, you need an Instagram, you need a Tiktok, you need to get on YouTube - and and then you're like, how, what? How you need to do like, 18 different things. And you're like, how does, how do I fit that all in, and how do I make it all work? And what does it have to do with each other. Like, I that was always my roadblock, you know, like, I was like, how am I supposed to handle these 18 different things that you're supposed to do? And how do you make them do what you want them to do? And it just especially when you're like a one man band, like most of us are, like, I mean, some of us have assist, even with assistance, it's like, how do you juggle all these things? And I just kept thinking, like, I don't get this, like I am the type that if I don't want to do it, I'll just kind of like, let it go. So, you know, marketing first thing to go for me. I'm like, I won't post today. So I'll just make another product. It's fine. I don't care. That was always my go to and eventually, like when I said my my sales kind of started to dwindle. I was like, I think I have to figure this out. I have to learn how to do this. And your course, you took all the different things, like SEO, Pinterest, blogging, and you made that connection for me. Like you kind of put it together and made me see the whole big picture as to what those things do in the funnel, what part they play in that whole thing, and how they grow your business, and how you can make them work together. Instead of like feeling like you have to plan all these different entities, it's more like, if I make a blog post, you know, I have to make a pin on Pinterest so people can find that blog post. And I also need to learn SEO so that it pops up when they're looking for that thing. And it, it just connects everything. And it you just feel like you can now plan what you're doing, and you don't feel overwhelmed because you're like, I don't have to do all the things over here. I just have to do what will make the other parts work. It clicked for me once you, like, put it all together. And I think it's just such a big, important part of it.

Stephanie: 16:10

Yeah and I think one of the challenges, and that was at the at the heart of why I wanted to create the course, was just that, I think when it comes to organic marketing, especially when people are ready to start hiring out, because those service providers are often compartmentalized, like I'm gonna hire someone for social media and I'm going to hire someone for Pinterest or for blogging, and because we typically see those services hired out in compartments, we kind of treat them as compartments independently, right? Yeah, and so that's actually why I stopped. I stopped offering just Pinterest or just blogging, because really the best results come when you treat it together. So all of my clients, they get blogging and Pinterest from me, because it works the best when they work together. I'm glad to hear that feedback. I appreciate that. But I want to go back just a second, because I thought you said something really important earlier, when you talked about building the airplane while you're flying it. And I think so many TPT sellers can relate, because they started their blogs in one way, and then they make changes to their business over time, and then they get this feeling of overwhelm, like, holy cow, I'm gonna have to redo my whole website. I need a web designer. I need to rebrand. I have all these old embarrassing posts, but like you said, yours are all still there.

Lisa: 17:37

They're still there.

Stephanie: 17:38

Mine, mine are all still there from my early days of blogging, before I knew SEO, they're still there. And guess what? They still bring me money.

Lisa: 17:47

That's why I don't take them down. I don't want to undo all the work I did. So I'm like, they can stay. It's fine.

Stephanie: 17:54

Yeah. And so I think that was just a really important point to make I think for people listening, is that you can change moving forward and maybe go back and fix some things, you can. But really you can start where you are, fix the things that really need fixing, but then ultimately, just keep moving forward. And I just, I love that you brought that message today, because I think, I think a lot of people need to hear that. But speaking of like, going back in time, if you could, what would you do differently in your organic marketing journey?

Lisa: 18:32

Probably everything. I made so many mistakes. Well, for one, I guess my number one thing that I think would help me probably consistency. Because, like I said, if I don't want to do something and I don't feel like I have time for it that day, I'm not doing it. I'm just, you know, I'll go weeks without posting. I'm like, sorry, I'm working on a coloring book. I'm not telling you guys what I'm doing. So consistency, I feel like, makes a big difference, and I'm seeing that now, because now I'm making myself do all the parts. And I'm seeing that when you are consistent, it really does. It builds quicker, and people start to, like, come back, because they expect things from you. And it's just, it's so important, and that's my one downfall. I wish I had thought about the end picture or the end goal before I started throwing spaghetti at the wall, because part of the problem of, like, pivoting and choosing what to do next in your business, like, if you don't have, like, an ultimate end goal, like this is what I'm going to work up to. I didn't have that. I just kept trying things, and if they were fun, I kept doing them. If they weren't, I didn't do it. So what came along with that was these, like little bits and pieces of what I was doing, and then when I was tired of that thing, or if it wasn't working. I just kind of, like, left it there and moved on. I just kept going. I didn't go back and undo anything. I was like, just go. Just keep going. It's fine. So I think, and I know it's hard for a lot of people to make that decision, like, what is your end goal? Like, I don't know. It's such a big question. And I'm still there too, like, I still don't completely know, but if you at least look maybe like a year at at least ahead and think, where do you want to be next year, what will do that for me? Like, what blog posts should I write to make that happen? Or what Pinterest pins will bring people to that post and help that grow, like, think about the end result and work your way backwards. And I wish I had, like, thought that way from the beginning, because, like, I said, like I have, you know, if you dig in my website, there's all kinds of stuff in the back. I have, like, VIP kid or online ESL teaching blog posts, I have outschool teaching, and I don't even know there's a couple about things I learned on how to sell things on TPT. Like, I just, I just kept throwing stuff out there to see what works. And, like you said, with your tree, like, when you're trying to grow your tree, like, those are different trees, but it's somehow, you know, like it all kind of came together eventually. So I just think, if you come up with something you want to do, think about the end result and think about what you need to create to get you to that point and create those things - like stay there and stay in your lane and keep creating and keep growing that thing, and just don't give up.

Stephanie: 21:54

Yeah and I think that's a really important point, because especially like when people do start getting into SEO and keyword research. There are a lot of fun keyword opportunities out there, right?

Lisa: 22:06

Oh, yeah.

Stephanie: 22:06

And it's easy to get distracted and think, Oh, I could write a blog post about that. And then you have to, like, stop yourself and think, Well, wait, my goal was, this, is that blog post really going to serve that purpose? And that's kind of getting into the content pillars and not confusing Google and yeah, it all works together. And it does. It starts with having that vision for your business. And so with that in mind, now that you have these awesome coloring books and you have, you know, an idea of the kinds of blog posts that people like from you. So what is your current goal? Or like your plan moving forward for content creation with these awesome coloring books in mind?

Lisa: 22:49

Well, my goal is to stick to content creation unlike I did in the past, and I want to make more like videos, helping people like, you know, just giving them that like, I love making the videos with the vibe, like the cozy, you know, stress relieving vibe of coloring, like, not just, you know, let's sit down and just scribble like, no, like, you're doing this for like, self care. You're doing this to feel better and just forget everything else is happening. And, you know, but blog wise, I want to put out more freebies for people. I have, like, a monthly freebie on my email list that I started doing consistently. I want to stick with that and go more in that direction. And another thing I actually, I have post its everywhere over here, and I keep, you know, so many little ideas. But one of the things is, I do want to look up what other things people look for, coloring pages for that might be hard to find, and I want to fill those little holes. So that's something you know, you can do with your blog, where I have a couple coloring sets that are always at the top of my like, top traffic list. Like, people are always finding them. And I feel like I can find more little, you know, like, all the cute little holidays, like, there's Macaroni and Cheese Day and stuff like that. Like, I feel like I want to fill up those little cracks that people need activities for. So yeah, that's, that's what I want to do, just kind of like, hone in on this and and really, like do it.

Stephanie: 24:27

That's the beauty of it is I think sometimes people, they try to cast a really wide net with their website from the beginning.

Lisa: 24:35

Oh yeah.

Stephanie: 24:36

But what you're saying, and I really agree with it, is that once you figure out your niche and the audience that you want to serve, it's actually a smaller pool, but you can still cast a wide keyword net. And so once you know like the topic you want to blog about consistently, then you're able to, like you said, fill those little keyword holes, and you're able to still cast a wide net and really become an authority in that space. And I think I'm really excited to see that happen for you. And then are you going back through your old content to, like, plug your coloring book in there when possible?

Lisa: 25:15

Actually, maybe that's a good question for you, because that's something we've talked about. Because my first thought when I put out the first coloring book, I was like, oh, I need to have links to this everywhere. I need to, you know, like, because I'm already getting traffic, but I need to make sure those those people who are seeing the other coloring pages know that this is here. So actually, one of your podcasts I just binged the other day, talked about too many calls to action,

Stephanie: 25:45

Oh the CTA buffet,

Lisa: 25:46

Yes, that one. And it was so funny that I listened to that, because I was like, Oh, maybe I shouldn't just throw this link all over the place, because that is kind of what you're saying. Like, you know, I have a blog post, and it's like, Hey, here's these free coloring pages for this topic. And a mistake I used to make was like, I would throw in like, Hey, look at all these Amazon products, like these crayons that you might want to check out to with your coloring pages. You might want to buy this paper to print your coloring pages on. And I had all kinds of links in there, and I stopped doing that. And when I heard that blog post, I was like, should I add, like, another link to these posts? Like, is that too? Like, is that a buffet?

Stephanie: 26:30

I don't think it's a buffet. I think you know, you'll likely notice that you won't get a lot of clicks from the freebie blog posts because they're they're there to get something for free. But there's nothing wrong with putting it in there as a banner or whatever, just to let them know. Like, I also make these coloring books, or you can have it in like, if you have an author box, which is really helpful on your post to show that you're an authority. Google loves author bio boxes right now, and so you could, you could have it in there that you're, you're the creator of this coloring book series on Amazon, and have the link there. So there's lots of ways you can do it, and I would just suggest doing it in a very post specific way. And just kind of think about, okay, whoever clicked on this link to read this post, what are they most likely to do? And so from there, you can kind of just gauge of what would work best. But yeah, I'm excited to see and so if other people want to follow along with you and kind of keep track of what you're up to, where can they find you, Lisa?

Lisa: 27:38

My website is www dot lisamarklesparkles.com, I am on Tiktok and Instagram as Lisa Markle Sparkle, same thing. I'm mostly on Instagram. If you ever want to message me on - I am always on it. I'm always chatting on there. I'm always happy to chat. So, yeah, that's probably the best way.

Stephanie: 28:01

Well, speaking of Instagram, I mean, this has been so fun because you and I, I mean, we have real time conversations on Instagram voice memos, but we've never actually spoken face to face at the same time. So this has been, this has been so fun.

Lisa: 28:17

It has, yeah, it's been great.

Stephanie: 28:19

Thank you so much for being our first guest on the Pay Less for Traffic podcast, and it has been so much fun to chat with you.

Lisa: 28:27

Thank you. I'm honored. This was great.

Stephanie: 28:29

All right, we'll talk later, Lisa,

Lisa: 28:31

Bye,

Stephanie: 28:33

thanks so much for listening to today's episode. If you enjoyed this conversation, I'd love it if you could share it with a teacher biz bestie. You have created high quality resources now let's help teachers find them. I'll see you next time.